Simulator Project Computer Proposal

  • Tuesday, November 26, 2019 1:50 PM
    Message # 8140471
    Korbin Friend (Administrator)
    The beginning of this post is copied from the simulator project email chain that was being used by the team to communicate about the project. I have posted the conversation from it to bring everyone up speed and to continue the discussion publicly with the chapter.


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    "I wanted to give another update to the simulator project for those that did not make it out to the November Chapter meeting. The computer is currently up and running and is at the point where the chapter needs to make a decision to invest in additional hardware or work with what we have. At the minimum the project requires two additional small screens even if the chapter decides not to upgrade the computer. Beyond the two screens I have outlined three different courses of action I thought of. If anyone else has any suggestions please reply to this email chain.


    1.  Work with what we have

        Pros 

    -No additional cost to the chapter beyond the required two screens (around $200ish)


        Cons

    -The performance of the simulation is poor 



    2. Cannibalize the current machine using some the parts to build a new computer 

    Pros

    -Performance for any simulation will be outstanding and will allow the chapter to stream lessons live, along with events such as IMC club.

    -Get exactly the type of machine we want


        Cons

    -Expensive and will require someone or a group of people to assembly and install software to the machine.


        Suggested parts/Price outline

    https://pcpartpicker.com/list/87Qt8M (This list is for computer components only, does not include screens)($1500ish)


    3. Buy a pre-build machine that is on holiday sale

    Pros

    -Performance for any simulation will be outstanding and will allow the chapter to stream lessons live, along with events such as IMC club.

    -Already built, ready to go out of the box


        Cons

    -Expensive

    -Often these pre-build machines skimp on one part such as a power supply that may need to be replaced at purchase ore down the road


        Suggested pre built machine

    https://www.bestbuy.com/site/ibuypower-gaming-desktop-intel-core-i7-9700f-16gb-memory-nvidia-geforce-rtx-2070-super-1tb-hdd-480gb-solid-state-drive-black/6362981.p?acampID=8fdc98c00ef411ea9ae7f6f2c7d713a&loc=8fdc98c00ef411ea9ae7f6f2c7d713a00INT&ref=8575135&skuId=6362981 (1200ish)


    I personally feel that the best course of action would be to cannibalize the current computer and rebuild the machine with current generation parts. I know the cost is steep to fully update the project, however I feel the return will be substantial. Allowing the 582nd to standout among other chapters and give people a insensitive to come out. In addition this computer would serve as a tool beyond just running simulation software. The computer can use this as a broadcasting machine to reach new faces to promote the chapter or fundraisers such as the Righteous Raffleâ„¢. As for the price, the holiday shopping season is beginning which is the best time to buy computer parts. I feel it's important that we make a decision sooner then later to capitalize on the holiday sales. Please replay to this email chain with any questions


    https://imgur.com/ng3BxO0"


    -Korbin Friend



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    "Hello all, I would like to thank Korbin for his efforts and options for the simulator computer.


    My opinion regarding this computer is a little different than Korbin's. I do agree both options would provide the computing solution and demands for the simulator. However, I really believe the best option for the club would be to buy an already configured gaming machine. I do not agree the store bought computer would have an underpowered power supply or parts that would quickly burn out. The main reason I am pro the store bought is because of the support and warranty. If we have a home built computer, then we will always need to have a person in the club to be willing and able to provide support when something breaks and we will need to buy the replacement parts. An already purchased computer can come with on-site support and I believe this is very important for a club setting. If something does break (such as the power supply), then support will come to the club and replace the parts under the warranty. Regarding the store bought computer that Korbin scoped out, the only change I would suggest is to increase the memory from 16 gb to 32 gb and make sure we are using Windows 64 bit vs 32 bit.


    Regards,

    Bryan Boyer"


     -Bryan Boyer



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    "To all,


    This is a really good discussion and I am sure it will lead to the optimal upgrade to our computer. I would like to ask a favor though, could we please move this discussion to the website for all to see.  This is one reason why we have a website in the first place.  I addition to allowing the members to respond at their convenience, it builds a record of the discussion.  So if you would, please go to https://eaachapter582.wildapricot.org/page-1736406 and subscribe.  I hope to be using this feature more in the future on various programs and you all can help get the process rolling.


    Thanks,


    Bill"


    -Bill David




    Last modified: Tuesday, November 26, 2019 1:50 PM | Korbin Friend (Administrator)
  • Tuesday, November 26, 2019 3:23 PM
    Reply # 8140648 on 8140471
    Korbin Friend (Administrator)

    "Hello all, I would like to thank Korbin for his efforts and options for the simulator computer.


    My opinion regarding this computer is a little different than Korbin's. I do agree both options would provide the computing solution and demands for the simulator. However, I really believe the best option for the club would be to buy an already configured gaming machine. I do not agree the store bought computer would have an underpowered power supply or parts that would quickly burn out. The main reason I am pro the store bought is because of the support and warranty. If we have a home built computer, then we will always need to have a person in the club to be willing and able to provide support when something breaks and we will need to buy the replacement parts. An already purchased computer can come with on-site support and I believe this is very important for a club setting. If something does break (such as the power supply), then support will come to the club and replace the parts under the warranty. Regarding the store bought computer that Korbin scoped out, the only change I would suggest is to increase the memory from 16 gb to 32 gb and make sure we are using Windows 64 bit vs 32 bit.


    Regards,

    Bryan Boyer" -Quote



    I want to a elaborate on some of the points that I brought up. Most pre-built machines from big box stores skimp on some aspect of the build that the unfamiliar would not notice. Before any purchase is made we would want to inspect the machine before hand, as well as what version of the parts are being used. For example the best buy computer I linked, I couldn't find the PSU model or model number listed as well as what version of the 2070 super.


    For my example about poor PSUs, walmart released a prebuilt line of Gaming PCs last year to compete with best buy's prebuilt Gaming PCs. These had several pit falls such as over all poor built quality, single sticks of ram to cheap PSUs. Most notability was the glass panel on the front of the case restricted air flow to the point of over heating unless it was modified or removed. Most of these flaws from the machine would go unnoticed unless you had experience with building computers. Majority of pre-built machines have similar aspects, but are worth when the price is right. Quality is often not what you get when you buy premade it's savings. I feel strongest point of getting a prebuilt machine would be convenience and save money. 


    --Supporting Links about prebuild PCs--

    (Walmart Gaming PC: How to do everything wrong)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTni-Vfrf9c


    (I FIXED EVERYTHING WRONG WITH Walmart's Gaming PC)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RM-mgyPaGoA


    (This is why you don't buy a computer from Best Buy)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZzxX2Byeis




    On the second point about the warranty. I feel the big box warranty programs are a deficit, especially geek squad. They are useful for product returns outside of standard 30 day return windows. However geek squad's support has a laughable reputation for incompetent repair on top of having to schedule them to come out.


    In addition most repairs made to computers involve part replacement, which is generally straight forward. I feel repair services are useful for diagnostic help or something like board repair. I would personally refuse to have any big box repair service work on my machines, even more so when we have the talent and knowledge within the chapter to fix majority of issues that can arise. Going back to our bad power supply example, once you have the replacement part, swapping out old part for a new one is a under a 10mins progress and can be explain on youtube in under 4mins. 


    --Supporting Links about part replacement--

    (How to remove a Power Supply)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA1XXjLmvxI


    (How to install and remove a graphics card)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqnYWsHNGaI


    I feel with upgrading the chapter's current machine allows us to avoid any unforeseen pitfalls as well as ensuring we are getting quality parts. The main difference of course is additional time and money.




    Last modified: Tuesday, November 26, 2019 3:23 PM | Korbin Friend (Administrator)
  • Tuesday, November 26, 2019 4:49 PM
    Reply # 8140793 on 8140471

     I would like to see the simulator able to shoot approaches and log them. The FAA recently put out the information required for that and it is not that much anymore. We could charge people to use it to upgrade their approach currency help pay for the new simulator parts. 


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